From the "People" Archives:

by Amy Goodman

Chris Smith, Sarah Price, and Mark Borchardt are on a tight schedule. In mid-October, they swooped into Manhattan at the very beginning of a dizzying, one month-long, twenty-city publicity tour to promote "American Movie," the documentary portrait that won the Documentary Grand Jury Prize at this year's Sundance Film Festival, where Sony Pictures Classics acquired the film for somewhere between $750,000 and just shy of one million dollars.

In the modest melee of a documentary press tour, indieWIRE grabbed interviews with director Chris Smith and producer Sarah Price, as well as with the subject of "American Movie," the one and only aspiring filmmaker, Mark Borchardt. Borchardt is accompanying the filmmakers on their grueling press tour because he is as disarmingly charismatic in real life as he is. . . well, in real life on screen. "American Movie" is about Mark's passionate desire to be a filmmaker and make his movies, while living an otherwise minimum wage existence in his hometown, Menomonee Falls, Wisconsin.

At Sundance, Mark was a flash of the purest desire for artistic integrity in a town full of comparative darkness; he reflected the filmmaking audiences' innocent, film-loving, sellout-hating side, and his story was a big hit. While we decipher our own opinions of characters in documentaries, it is always revelatory to find out what the subjects think of their portrayal. Here's what Mark has to say on independent film, his goatee, the American dream, his short horror film "Coven" and struggling to make his debut feature "Northwestern."

indieWIRE: Do you like what Chris has done...

Mark Borchardt: Well yeah, I'm sitting here talking to you, man.

iW: What's happened to you since the film premiered at Sundance?

Borchardt: Well, I started working in a factory 10 hours a day designing shutters for the outside of windows, man, out where I live. Hell yeah. For four months straight out where I live, man.

iW: How much an hour?

Borchardt: Uh, eight and a half. And I had to do it to pay bills. So, after Sundance it went back to normalcy again, but when we went to Toronto, I quit my job a week or two before we went and it's all been going uphill since Toronto. So, it's not since Sundance, it's since Toronto that this has all kicked into high gear.

iW: When you say that things have really picked up do you mean for you personally or for the film?

Borchardt: No, for the film, not for me personally 'cause nothing's picked up at all for me, really. But for the film, yeah, you could feel the energy and the vibrancy and the momentum that it's producing.

iW: Do you hope or expect that anything will happen for you and your filmmaking out of this?

Borchardt: No, I just want to be responsible for my own actions and start on my own film. I think it will be a little bit easier to get people to help, to scrape up money, definitely. But see, I've gotten dozens and dozens of business cards from film companies, and people have actually approached me on the street, saying, "Hey, you need money for your next film?" I've never taken it seriously, because I know that they're offering money to get money returned to them and then some more on top of that. So it becomes my responsibility, then, to make a film that makes money, and not a film that I want.

Again, man, I'm 33 and I don't have time to lose on that stuff. There's more than enough people that make films for other people for money, I think. I want to make money too, but I really want to do something more with my life at the same time that's a little bit more important. See, the only reason I would make a film for anyone else would be for women and money, and that's all. I don't take anything that Hollywood makes seriously. Life's about women, life's about paying the bills and maybe getting some new shoes and crap like that and getting nice stuff with money. I really don't care about material stuff, and I wouldn't take the film too seriously. Of course, I'd do a good job and all that, but those two factors would be my main two goals for doing anything outside of a personal film.

iW: So, do you identify yourself as an arch independent filmmaker?

Borchardt: No, not at all. Every time I hear those words -"independent filmmaker" - it freaks me out because I don't want to have nothing to do with that kind of mentality. To be an independent filmmaker and to be against the Hollywood system doesn't matter to me. I just want to make films. I grew up studying Welles and Polanski and Kubrick, Scorsese and Allen, Fellini and Bergman and all of that stuff. That's all. I just want to make good films and I don't give a damn... But wait, I don't mean to slur this whole interview by saying I don't give a damn about independent filmmaking and Hollywood filmmaking, but I don't give a damn in my mind. I just want to make good films.

iW: I'm sure you're aware that many people see the film, as an indieWIRE editor said to me this morning, as "every independent filmmaker's grand metaphor." How do you feel about that?

Borchardt: The only reason I wear a goatee is because I don't like to shave, man. That's how I feel about it. Somebody else can do that cause for independent filmmaking. I just want to make good films, personal films.

iW: So, what is "American Movie" about in your eyes? It's your story. Do you see it as your story?

Borchardt: Yeah, I do, and I'm glad they documented it. It's like a Christmas gift, man, to have your life documented and playing at the Film Forum. When I look at the screen I don't see me as I'm talking to you right now. I see this other character in making a film. I see a really ambitious guy doing his thing that will inspire me the next time I make my next film. I also see a community of these valuable people who helped me achieve that goal, you know. And I'm deeply indebted to them for that.

iW: Do you have any idea what affect you will have on audiences?

Borchardt: That's really important to me. The movie won't affect everybody the same way. The people struggling to achieve their goals, I think they'll come away a little bit more inspired and a little bit more determined. That could be a great blessing that the film could provide to a handful of people - to stick with what they need to do and to not quit.

iW: One of the strongest themes in "American Movie" is the American Dream theme. Do you interpret the story of the American Dream as a comedy or a tragedy?

Borchardt: Oh, it could be both, man. Because for the lower man on the fiscal totem pole who engages in, like, what I did, of course it becomes comical because you have to use other means other than monetary means to make things happen. Like tricks. Also, it could become tragic because you could destroy yourself in the process of trying to achieve it, never having accomplished nothing. Then yeah, you've got the third element, and that's achieving the American Dream. There's comedy, tragedy, and actually achieving it. So there you have it: a three-act structure all wrapped up.

iW: Which one of those three elements does your story fit into?

Borchardt: I think all three. There's the comedy of the situations I create, there's the tragedy of alcoholism - and that could be a real life pain in the ass if something bad happens - and there is the achievement of the goal because I'm here. I'm gonna keep going, I'm gonna get every god-É I'm going to swear... I'm gonna get every goddamned thing that I want, man, basically. And I'm not trying to be arrogant or nothing, that's just being thankful for being here, trying to take advantage of my time on earth.

iW: What is every goddamned thing that you want?

Borchardt: Women, the bills paid, and to make good films.

iW: In that order?

Borchardt: No, of course not. Probably to make good films, and then the bills, and then stuff like women or food and crap like that.

iW: Have you read or heard people say that they think the film is condescending?

Borchardt: Oh, sure, people have always indicated, "Are they laughing with you or at you or that?" I could give a damn, man, as long as the film is successful, people can think it's condescending or patronizing all they want. It doesn't affect me at all.

iW: Do you think it's condescending?

Borchardt: No, absolutely not, because I'm responsible for any behavior you see up on the screen and Chris did not manipulate it in any way other than what it was. It was always what it was. I've seen the film over and over again and that's me. I don't feel foolish or mocked or anything because if I was some austere European director wearing all black and crap like that he never would have made a film about me. There would have been no interest.

iW: Are you still working on your feature "Northwestern"?

Borchardt: That's the only thing I'm doing and concentrating on in my life. If it's the last thing I do I'll be happy. I've been casting for years and I've videotaped all the auditions, and I've given up on the idea of using actresses and actors. I'm going to use real people, man, 'cause it's too important to me to screw it up in any way. I've got all these actresses and actors all wanting to be in the film and they just don't get it. I'm in the middle of the fifth draft, I can't concentrate for the life of me. What we're doing for the next couple months is publicity for "American Movie," and when I get to Milwaukee, man, people are calling me trying to set all this crap up. It's like, I'm trying to make a film here. Why the hell would I get involved in your projects, your meetings, your this, your that? That's not what I'm about.

iW: So the movie HAS changed your life?

Borchardt: I'm selling more copies of "Coven" so I don't have to work at some stupid-ass job no more, which is great, man, to be paying my bills that way.

iW: How many have you sold?

Borchardt: I've sold about 260 of them so far, plus T-shirts and crap like that.

iW: You're not making window shutters anymore?

Borchardt: No. If I play my cards right, I'm pretty confident that that will be the last time I work for anybody. People don't understand. They think I'm doing all this to get into the door in Hollywood and I want nothing to do with it. And all of these business calls. I don't want to hop on the phone and have to return calls and make calls and go in all of these circles. There's a lot of people who think it would be cool to make movies and that's why I stopped going out with those people to bars and coffee shops, because they talk a little bit louder and look around to see who's looking. My blood just started to run hot, so I just stopped doing that. It was totally embarrassing, man.

iW: Did you immediately say "Yes" when Chris asked you if he could make this movie?

Borchardt: Immediately. I'd seen [Smith's previous film] "American Job" and I knew him a little as a person because I was in his class. He was teaching a Works in Progress class at UW Milwaukee and he saw me coming in with all of these stacks of film all the time. While other people were talking about films they were going to make, looking down at their shoes, staring up at the ceiling and all of that stuff. I kept showing all of these quarter-foot cans of films to people and Chris said, "Hey, man, can I make a movie on you?" and I said sure. I knew he wasn't going to waste one second of his time or one frame of his film if he didn't believe in what he was doing and immediately, I said "Yeah."

iW: Why did you decide to be a filmmaker?

Borchardt: I didn't decide. I really didn't have a choice. Ever since I was a kid I didn't watch TV or movies. I thought they were always corny and stupid and a waste of time. But I thought the way people interacted among each other and the cool things they said were intriguing. Then, when I saw this guy, our friend, walking to school with a movie camera, I thought, "Wait a second, man. I can record all this stuff that I think and feel and want to show." And when I saw "Close Encounters" for the first time ever in a ranch house where I lived I thought, "Wow, this is where I grew up." I'd never been in a two-story house or climbed up stairs like the ones in "The Brady Bunch." I couldn't relate to any of that stuff. It took me aback, man. Also, "The Dawn of the Dead," with the gray skies and barren trees, man, that's how Wisconsin is in the winter. I thought, wow, that's groovy, all these people in National Guard with army jackets and flannel shirts, and that haunting, synthesized music and violins... All that stuff had a chilling effect on me. I though, I've got to do this, man, and that's why I'm here. (Snaps) Instantaneously, and I never looked back. I'm going to make films till I die.

[In tomorrow's indieWIRE, Goodman speaks to director Chris Smith and producer Sarah Price.]

[Amy Goodman's last article for indieWIRE was a roundup review of the documentaries at the 1999 Sundance Film Festival. She is currently traveling in Thailand.]